So what do the Community of British Muslims do about it ? Not a lot it seems. They appear to be obsessed with playing the victim anytime a young Muslim is arrested for terrorist related offenses and to be fair they do have some room to complain. But in a perverse way they have set themselves up as victims by not tackling the problem of radical Islam. In fact they tend to hide behind the Koran and say that those who commit acts of Terrorism are misguided and others who are thinking about following the same path need to be taught what Islam is really about. But the funny thing is they don't appear to be teaching those young men and women those lessons at all.
Even after the 7/7 bombings in London the families of some of the bombers would not be believe there children, brothers etc had committed such acts of barbarity.
Muslims in the UK seem to be in denial about the threat of Fundamentalist Islam.
Now one of two things will happen:
Muslims will wake up to the threat and help those angry young men channel their anger about British policy in Iraq etc through democratic means.
They will carry on being in denial and more Terror attacks that kill all sections of the UK population will become a regular occurrence.
This will of course feed the likes of the British Nationalist Party who will use it as propaganda to attack Muslims. So Muslims will become victims of hate crimes and that will also fuel the fires of radical Islam in the UK. So we all have to work together to get this problem sorted out and under control as i do not want to have to go through 30 years or more of terrorism. I may sound racist, but I'm not really.
I would love for all sections of the UK's multicultural society to get along with one another. As it is beneficial for everyone if that happens. There are some long and dark days ahead of everyone in the UK, no matter what religion you might follow.
16 comments:
It almost seems predictable that the "moderate" Muslims fail every time to speak out except for when it comes to crying about being persecuted.
Until Muslims rat out the bad ones on a continuous basis, there is no reason to sympathize with them and look at them as anything but terrorists and terrorist enablers.
http://www.danielpipes.org/blog/83
http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/089526076X/qid=1087507150/sr=8-1/ref=sr_8_xs_ap_i1_xgl14/002-8462209-1058420?n=507846&s=books&v=glance
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We are not the racists. We are the next line of defense.
HERE
NOW,
R
We need websites and groups opposed to muslim fascism that are not just shills for the right wing like Daniel Pipes. In fact, I see that as an important project for the left to undertake, a large scale anti-islamofascism movement that also is against the people like pipes and david horowitz.
Jason:
Well, this website stands for liberal values. That is why I support Israel so intensely - because I consider myself a liberal!
http://cultureforall.blogspot.com/2006/07/what-does-culture-for-all-mean.html
The UK has a big problem.
One way to combat Islamofascism in the USA I think is to introduce in Congress a Declaration of War against Islamic Fascism. Over at my weblog I have started drafting a resolution. Any suggestions will be appreciated.
Taking Sides
Poor Jason...
You've been a liberal for so long you didn't realize your party was being hijacked out of under you, did you?
Pipes isn't a shill for the Right, or the Left. Pipes was an anti-IslamoFacist long before 9/11. That's the only thing I've ever seen or read Pipes shill for.
Now there's no doubt that Horowitz is on the Right. Who knows, maybe he's even a shill. But, given his backround and personal history, I think he's entitled to make the point.
The large-scale anti-IslamoFacist movement on the Left that you're looking for is already happening.
Tens of thousands of Jews, Blacks, Homosexuals, and other minorities are slowly realizing that the Left and the American Democratic Party are infested with the very neo-Nazi's and genocidal haters that they were thought were on the other side.
The links I left in this thread, (did you actually read them Jason, or just kneejerk out a response to the names?), detail some of the many links between the Left, IslamoFacism, and the Nazi's. That's why I posted those links here. (and for Miss R's benefit as well).
Jason, the Christian Church isn't the threat to you and your lifestyle that you seem to think it is. The Christers may not like what you stand for, but they won't pull a wall down on you to make their point.
Reverend Fred (God hates fags) Phelps is the exception to the above, and he is a staunch Democrat and former Gore campaign fundraiser.
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You can vote yourself onto the cattlecars, or you can open your eyes and take a stand with the rest of us.
There are no liberals in war, only losers.
PICK UP
THE FLAG,
R
Render:
That is an exaggeration and you know it.
There are plenty of pro-Israel and strong-willed against the Islamofascists Democrats.
The problem is that the far leftist base is getting all the media attention, and is trying to take over the party. I find this frightening. I find many of the Democrat Congressmen to be flat out scary (Maxine Waters, Cynthia McKinney) but then, so are many Republican Congressmen, such as Tom DeLay.
I am still dedicated to liberal values, and I believe the Democrats are not a lost cause.
I will fight to tooth and nail against the party becoming the party of Cindy Sheehan. It's not yet, despite the hopes and dreams of Kos and friends.
Finally, I have to agree with Render about Daniel Pipes. He is not a hack, and he has a hell of a lot of great points to make. I read from all sources, be they liberal or conservative.
Keeps the mind fresh.
Miss R - "That is an exaggeration and you know it."
Mr R - Hmmm perhaps. I thought it more of an opinion when I wrote it, (the tens of thousands part). Nontheless, the knife in Liebermans back came from the partys highest levels of leadership.
Miss R - "There are plenty of pro-Israel and strong-willed against the Islamofascists Democrats."
Mr R - Again, this is only an opinion on my part, partly based on my 96 year old grandfather changing parties, having been a Democrat since 1931.
Miss R - "The problem is that the far leftist base is getting all the media attention, and is trying to take over the party. I find this frightening. I find many of the Democrat Congressmen to be flat out scary (Maxine Waters, Cynthia McKinney) but then, so are many Republican Congressmen, such as Tom DeLay."
Mr R - Yeah, that's a major part of the problem alright. The freakazoid base of the Left has been working toward this goal since the late 60's. Not just in the media, but as Horowitz points out ad nauseum, in higher education as well. They were so well entrenched and far into this plan, that the fall of the Soviet Union barely phased their agendas.
-McKinny is just one of the anti-semitic genocide enablers hiding behind the Democratic party's tattered old flag. Such as David Duke, the aforementioned Fred Phelps, Al Sharpton, Jesse Jackson, Louis Farrahkan, Robert Byrd...
(The greatest lie the devil ever told, was that he didn't exist.)
Miss R - "I am still dedicated to liberal values, and I believe the Democrats are not a lost cause."
Mr. R - I have no wish to change or even challenge your political values. But I do think that the Democratic party, as it stands currently,...I've run short on polite words...
- Lets call a spade a spade. The Democratic party doesn't seem to like Jews, at all.
- I just prefer my corrupt polititians to do a slightly better job of hiding their anti-semitism.
THUNDERBOLT
&
LIGHTNING,
R
Render:
But then again, the Jack Abramoff scandal touches mainly Republicans, not Democrats. The Republicans are also tied to the Christian Conservative base, who, while they support Israel and are strongly against the Islamofascists, are also against pretty much everything else I believe in. The Republicans have furthermore pretty much abandoned their old doctrine of fiscal conservatism.
Moreover, there are many Democrats who simply do not fit the paradigm you speak of, which I do not deny exists. The truth is that the Democratic Party leadership did rally behind Lieberman for the primary - but once he lost, they were really forced to back Lamont, due to party politics.
All hope is not lost in the Democratic Party.
Not yet.
But I do wish there was a third option, a "purple party," so to speak.
Noting the moral equations attempted by others above...
John Huang.
China has not been an ally since 1946.
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Of course, none of this touches on the posts original intent.
Europe has a nasty history of being a lot nastier then the US has ever been when faced with such a situation.
We assimilate. Europe cleanses.
GENERIC
METAPHORS,
R
I reckon we should just burn and kill all Muslims. I hate those guys. If they don't rat out their own, then they should be wiped off the face of the planet. So what if we're bombing their sand-nigger brethren in Iraq? They deserve it for the security of Israel.
Also, if they can't live by our democratic ways, like the stupid brown people they are, they should be stripped naked and made to walk through the streets - men and women alike. I absolutely condone violence towards them because they are scum. Each and every one of them. Then we'll see who's being "persecuted". To hell with civil liberties. I mean, it's not like the vast majority of British Muslims have condemned 7/7, is it? It's not like the vast majority of British Muslims have only ever wanted to live peacefully with their neighbours, is it? All this hiding behind the Qur'an business: load of bloody nonsense to refer to that book coz all the terrorists believe in it, innit. Trying to point out otherwise is a waste of bloody time because they're all out to get us. Kill 'em all!
ENGLAND PREVAILS!
Chops:
Please show me links supporting your contention that the vast majority of Muslims have publicly condemned 7/7. I would like to say that groups such as the Muslim Council of Britain both publicly denounced 7/7, and then privately said it was justified. So I am asking you for proof that the vast majority of Muslims have both publicly and privately said terrorism is bad.
Guess what? You cannot provide such proof because it doesn't exist.
As far as civil liberties go...it's called common sense. It's called "gee, if the terrorists (generally) all fit a certain profile, we should be checking that profile."
This is hardly the breakdown of civil liberties in order to acknowledge reality.
As far as wire tapping/etc, when did I or anyone on this blog say that I was okay with that, without warrants? Never. In fact I have publicly come out against it.
And as far as the "kill every Muslim" thing...nope, not advocating that, and never would, and think that's gross to even suggest it.
But then again, there are certain people such as Nasrallah, who have advocated for the death to all Jews.
How on Earth can you gauge what the vast majority of Muslims think? I know: how about capturing each and every one of them into camps and conducting a poll, asking "Do you condone terrorism?" That will work.
If you expect them to denounce terrorism, then the rest of the country should denounce the war in Iraq by constantly protesting in masses on the streets of London. The MCB is not representative of the majority of Muslims.
In fact, there are NO organisations which adequately represent the majority of Muslims. They are mostly without a voice. SHOW ME a link that suggests otherwise. IF the vast majority of Muslims condoned terrorism, you'd have a far, far greater number of terrorist incidents in the UK. But you don't. So tell me, WHERE is this supposed majority?
Chops:
You yourself have said things such as "Well, terrorism is bad, but it's understandable because of XYZABC." Hence, to that extent, you are giving a moral equivalence.
I am not saying the vast majority of Muslims are pro-terror. But the vast majority of Muslims also have not taken a stance AGAINST terror, either.
This is just a proven fact. If Muslims wanted to take such a stance, they would. They would start organizations if such organizations don't exist, they would make their voices heard. And it's not like SOME haven't done just that. Some have.
But the vast majority have not. And yes, public opinion polls also substantiate this obvious reality.
I see your point, but then you automatically assume we should apologise for the actions of a few misguided fools. I don't see why the Muslims should have to apologise. The Islamic view is quite clear on the subject of terrorism: it is not allowed. Muslims are constantly re-iterating this point. Go into a mosque and tell me otherwise.
How is it a crime to then say "We should discuss WHY terrorism is happening in the UK." Tony Blair refuses to acknowledge the war in Iraq has made some people turn to extremism. He's deluded. The man was warned by intelligence services prior to 7/7 that being involved in Iraq is creating extremists in the country. Yet, when the attacks happened, WE'RE the ones expected to apologise? Bollocks. I am just as outraged as anyone else over terrorism. I denounce it. It is evil. But why is it happening? What has angered these men so much to take another life? By asking that question, I'm somehow not loyal to my country, it seems.
Free-thinking Muslims are criminals. Lock 'em up and throw away the key.
Rehan, there is a difference between condemning terrorism and then not following through and showing people how to get their frustrations across through democratic means and not through the gun and the bomb.
I guess younger Muslims like yourself need to get the message across to the disaffected brothers and sisters about showing your frustrations through peaceful means. As the old clerics/immams don't seem to have a clue or don't really care.
It's not only muslims who have to clean up, Catholics do as well in regards to certain actions that were taken in the past by the papacy and still do today ie contraception and lies about AID's in the developing world.
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